Talk:List of Impact Wrestling personnel/Archive 3

Archive 1

Archive 2

Archive 3

Suicide and Sangrieto

All reports have given us that Suicide is no longer Daniels and is back to being Kiyoshi and Amazing Red is now also wrestling as Sangrieto. I'm not going to edit, so you guys can go and use the site for sources you think are adequate, but it's going to have to change eventually. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.171.176.197 (talk) 01:06, 22 April 2011 (UTC)

A suggestion!

Can u move this 2 personnel rather than employees?92.235.168.144 (talk) 20:38, 15 May 2011 (UTC)

Anyone on the roster turn heel yet? 71.161.247.227 (talk) 21:32, 20 May 2011 (UTC)

Austin Aries

Even though on TNA website, he is still signed to TNA until Destination-X when they sign someone. Can you put it back up?

~Guest187~ — Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.209.173.162 (talk) 20:34, 20 June 2011 (UTC)

Ring Ka King/OVW

TNA has a wrestling project in India called Ring Ka King and some of the TNA Superstars are being used during this time. In fact Matt Morgan is the Heavyweight Champion for this project. Shouldn't there be a section on this page showing the list of TNA Superstars participating in this? Or atleast an option that directs to the Ring Ka King Wikipedia page? TNA has an agreement with OVW to be a developmental terriority for them. Shouldn't the TNA Roster page be set up the same way that FCW is set up on the WWE Roster page? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 65.196.158.240 (talk) 14:23, 21 December 2011 (UTC)

El Zorro

Six months ago, a lot of webpages reported that El Zorro had signed a contract with TNA, but today, he hasn't appeared. I think that his contract is a rumor.--79.151.215.61 (talk) 21:21, 22 January 2012 (UTC)

Page currently listing employees of WWE, not TNA

Emloyees listed currently are for WWE, not TNA. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 91.125.54.123 (talk) 12:55, 6 May 2012 (UTC)

Vandalism. I've reverted back to what seems to be the last clean version. Thanks, NiciVampireHeart 14:28, 6 May 2012 (UTC)

Farm territory

I think that we must create a new section, OVW or Farm territory to put Silva, Shaw, Hendrix, Robbie T and Crimson. Al Snow said in the radio that the gutcheck winners only have a develoment contract. --HHH Pedrigree (talk) 18:42, 8 October 2012 (UTC)

Adjustments

I've made a few adjustments to the page, and please indulge me while I explain them.

I moved Pat Kenney to commentators since that is an on-air role. While he's a road agent as well, any on-air role should take precedence in the listings since that is higher profile.

I moved Al Snow to executive officers since he does have the role of Sr. Director of Talent Relations, which is a front office job, road agent at this point is more of a side job.

I moved D-Lo Brown to backstage personnel since it really wouldn't make sense to have him in his own section.

I moved Sting to the active roster since he's actively involved in the Aces & 8s storyline, and he's still considered as a wrestler more than an authority figure (I've seen nothing listed where Sting is officially the Assistant GM). He's more of Hogan's trusted confidant than he is an official authority figure.

With all the surgeries the Hulkster has had, I doubt we'll see him wrestle anymore, so he's right where he needs to be.

Vjmlhds 14:02, 18 October 2012 (UTC)

Adjustments 2.0

OK, just to explain why I did what I did:

I added D-Lo Brown to the main roster since he's now officially thrown in with Aces and 8s. He has wrestled at house shows under the mask, and he's in there getting physically involved. This is different from Taz since Taz can't get involved physically.

I added Danny Davis to the list as he's now the new Gut Check Judge.

And it's not necessary to list guys as "member of Aces and 8s". Just like we don't list guys as "members of the Shield" in WWE or "members of SCUM" in ROH.

Vjmlhds 03:20, 8 March 2013 (UTC)

Adjustments 3.0

I added Robert W. Carter to the list because...well...he owns the joint. He owns the company that owns TNA, making thim the BIG BOSS of the whole shebang.

Also, Dixie Carter-Salinas uses her maiden name on the air (more or less as her "ring name"), but adds the -Salinas in her day to day life, so both need to be listed.

Vjmlhds (talk) 20:10, 20 June 2013 (UTC)

Tapa and Evan

OK. Let's talk, because i'm tired. Are Evan Markopolous and LeiD Tapa TNA Wrestlers? Tapa won Gut Check, so she won a TNA Develoment Contract and we have sources abour she is wrestling in OVW. Evan Markpopolous said six months ago that he will train in OVW on july 2013. Sources about he is training now? --HHH Pedrigree (talk) 16:35, 18 July 2013 (UTC)

Wrestling in OVW isn't the same as wrestling in NXT. Those who train in NXT are WWE owned. OVW is a partner promotion of TNA, not a division.

Markopoulos last (and first) wrestled in TNA in September 2012. Since then he's worked a few places, but TNA or OVW aren't among them.

Neither should be listed here. InedibleHulk (talk) 20:42, July 18, 2013 (UTC)

Yes, but Al Snow said that every gut check winner won a development contract and she is working in the farm territory. --HHH Pedrigree (talk) 12:46, 19 July 2013 (UTC)

Tapa and Evan stay off until TNA puts them on their website's roster. Dutt and Marasciulo also stay off the roster as it looks like they were only brought in for Destination X, and not as part of the regular crew. Vjmlhds (talk) 16:30, 19 July 2013 (UTC)

We all know thay TNA is very lazy to update the profiles and we have other sources. Ric Flair was in the roster page when other sources said that he left TNA. DOC and Knux hadn't profiles, but we listed them because other sources said that both of them were under contract. --HHH Pedrigree (talk) 17:08, 19 July 2013 (UTC)

While TNA does have a spotty record of keeping their roster page updated, there's nothing out there to suggest that anybody that we've been discussing have full-fledged TNA contracts. Vjmlhds (talk) 20:33, 19 July 2013 (UTC)

The thing to remember, HHH, is that a developmental deal in TNA is not like one in WWE. TNA doesn't own OVW, so those in OVW aren't working for TNA, though OVW and TNA are close partners. Gutcheck won them a spot in OVW, which may lead to a TNA contract, depending how they impress.

It's like if you were a cook, and impressed the owner of a restaurant. That owner may not have a place for you at the moment, but formally recommends you to a restaurant his friend owns, while leaving the door open. If you continue to cook well there, you may get an offer from the first restaurant when a place opens up, with a recommendation from the second one. But you only work for one boss at a time. InedibleHulk (talk) 16:58, 20 July 2013 (UTC)

Requested move 05:14, 13 July 2013 (UTC)

The following discussion is an archived discussion of the proposal. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the proposal was moved. --BDD (talk) 18:33, 22 July 2013 (UTC)

List of Total Nonstop Action Wrestling employees → List of Total Nonstop Action Wrestling personnel – Wrestlers are not employees, but independent contractors. Would be consistent with List of WWE personnel, as most of this article already is. InedibleHulk (talk) 05:14, 13 July 2013 (UTC)

Survey

Feel free to state your position on the renaming proposal by beginning a new line in this section with *'''Support''' or *'''Oppose''', then sign your comment with ~~~~. Since polling is not a substitute for discussion, please explain your reasons, taking into account Wikipedia's policy on article titles.

• Support- I'm the one who moved the WWE roster page to "personell". It just makes more sense for both of these articles to refrain from using "employees" due to the controversies surrounding independent contractors in the professional wrestling industry. Feedback ^☎ 13:02, 18 July 2013 (UTC)
• Support - To keep it consistent with the WWE page. If anything TNA operates more on a independent contractor bases then TNA, personnel is the more correct term.STATic message me! 18:15, 18 July 2013 (UTC)

Discussion

Any additional comments:

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the proposal. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

Jarrett and MMA

First, JobbersAreCool moved Karen Jarret from the roster, because this [ http://www.wrestlinginc.com/wi/news/2013/0708/563942/tna-drops-the-television-title/ source] says that TNA hasn't plans for 'JEFF and Karen. Do you think that we have to delete Jeff also? I don't know about contracts, but he disapeared and has't profile in TNA website. Second, when King Mo signed with Spike, we put "contract with Bellator". I think that we have to delete it. It was a good decision to inform the people, but Rampage Jackson is an active wrestler and he has also the note. --HHH Pedrigree (talk) 02:33, 21 July 2013 (UTC)

No real opinion, except that if we delete Karen based on one source, we have to delete Jeff and the TV title on the same source. InedibleHulk (talk) 19:40, 21 July 2013 (UTC)

I think we should wait on removing the TV title until there is a formal announcement by TNA, or Abyss starts appearing every week without it. Anyways I do not see "wrestlinginc" anywhere in the Style guide, so who is to say it is a reliable source in the first place. STATic message me! 20:38, 21 July 2013 (UTC)

It's sourced to PWInsider. That's on our "proven" list. Here is the original. InedibleHulk (talk) 20:59, 21 July 2013 (UTC)

Oh okay then, I had not even bothered clicking on the link. My opinion still stands how it pertains to the TV title, because plans can always change especially when it comes to wrestling. This is not the first time we have heard about the TV title possibly being discarded. I still remember the reports of the X-Division title and the US title being discarded. STATic message me! 21:57, 21 July 2013 (UTC)

Let's just make things easy...as long as TNA still lists the TV title as part of the championship roll call on thier website's roster page it stays on this list. As an example of a similar situation, even though the Knockouts Tag Team titles were MIA forever, as long as they were active on the TNA website's roster/roll call page, they stayed active here. Once the KO tag straps were removed from their list, then they were removed from our list (our meaning Wikipedia). Same should apply for the TV title. Vjmlhds talk) 23:26, 21 July 2013 (UTC)

Seems fair. Still, without similar mitigating factors for either Jarrett, we can't just pick one to remove. InedibleHulk (talk) 23:48, 21 July 2013 (UTC)

I have no problems with keeping the Jarretts off the list. My thing was I didn't want people removing the TV title because they saw something on a dirt sheet. Vjmlhds (talk) 01:09, 22 July 2013 (UTC)

Anyone else have a problem with removing Jeff Jarrett? Jobbers (or is it Mr. Cool?) objected first because he is the founder (founder is not a job position), now it's because of his Twitter handle. If I had Twitter, I'd be @InedibleHulk, but wolves could still actually eat me and I'm not really as big as Hulk Hogan or The Incredible Hulk. Should it be any different for @JeffJarrettTNA? InedibleHulk (talk) 01:34, 22 July 2013 (UTC)

Jobber deleted Karen due to a source. The source says that Jeff is in the same situation. Both of them are delete or both of them stay. I don't know if Jeff stills under TNA contract, but nobody knows about him near two years.--HHH Pedrigree (talk) 06:01, 23 July 2013 (UTC)

Pro Wrestling dot com says that Jarret was at Destination X. Maybe we should included both of them again. --HHH Pedrigree (talk) 06:11, 23 July 2013 (UTC)

Jeff Jarrett still works for TNA so he should be readded on list. [1] 5.69.99.18 (talk) 09:38, 23 July 2013 (UTC)

That source only says he was at the show, not on it or behind it, and it "caught a number of people by surprise". If he worked there, why would it be surprising? Notice it has a job title next to Broadhead and Barton's name, but nothing for Jarrett. In any case, it has absolutely nothing to do with Karen. InedibleHulk (talk) 01:37, 25 July 2013 (UTC)

The Gerweck one adds that he has "has maintained an involvement with the company". That's pretty vague. Is Gerweck even a reliable source? Gerweck isn't listed as reliable source, and his claim that ProWrestling.net reported Broadhead, Barton and Jarrett were the "other members of management" is clearly not accurate. InedibleHulk (talk) 01:41, 25 July 2013 (UTC)

One thing. We haven't a source about Jarrett release. I never read about Jarrett was fired from TNA, only that TNA hasn't plans for him. --HHH Pedrigree (talk) 12:11, 25 July 2013 (UTC)

On the other hand, do we have any source for any sort of job title or description for Jarrett? The last his article says of him is that he went to India to run Ring Ka King in 2011. Given that it's folded (or at least on hold), the logical assumption would be that Jarrett lost the job. Since then, there's been no story about him getting a new job within TNA (producing, training, concession stands, anything) and he hasn't been on TNA TV in almost two years.

So why would the default assumption be that he works there? And why were people surprised that he showed up backstage? InedibleHulk (talk) 22:06, 25 July 2013 (UTC)

I think that Carter hates him due to his relationship with Karen Angle. After he was "fired", he stilled under contract, without job. I think. --HHH Pedrigree (talk) 12:52, 26 July 2013 (UTC)

I haven't listened to the podcast backing Jarrett's new Director of Talent Relations job, but I'll assume it says it. However, I also found this, calling him Executive VP of Development/Original Programming, and Al Snow the Senior Director of Talent Relations. Of course, that's right after Prichard left, so could be dated now.

Anyway, do we know if the podcast said anything about Jarrett losing this VP position, or Snow losing his? If Jarrett's still a VP, as well as a director, he should be in the executive section. If he's just a director, backstage. And is Snow still on TV? If not, he should be moved backstage, too, just based on his "producer" credits. InedibleHulk (talk) 10:19, 9 August 2013 (UTC)

OK, the podcast strongly implies Snow was replaced by Jarrett, so it's cool to drop him, as far as Talent Relations go. Didn't hear anything about the other stuff. InedibleHulk (talk) 10:28, 9 August 2013 (UTC)

Pacman Jones

Please don't add Pacman Jones to the roster.

TNA just happens to be in Cincinnati tonight for Impact Wrestling, and Jones just happens to play for the Bengals, so TNA is having Pacman make an appearance since everybody just happens to be in the same place tonight.

There is NOTHING out there to suggest that Jones has signed on full time with TNA. He's quite busy with football at this point in time, and his appearance tonight is a "we just happen to be in the neighborhood, so come on over" deal.

Vjmlhds (talk) 23:49, 7 November 2013 (UTC)

Orphaned references in List of Total Nonstop Action Wrestling personnel

I check pages listed in Category:Pages with incorrect ref formatting to try to fix reference errors. One of the things I do is look for content for orphaned references in wikilinked articles. I have found content for some of List of Total Nonstop Action Wrestling personnel's orphans, the problem is that I found more than one version. I can't determine which (if any) is correct for this article, so I am asking for a sentient editor to look it over and copy the correct ref content into this article.

Reference named "SLAM":

• From Santana Garrett: CHHIBBER, RANJAN. "Taking a SHINE to rising star Santana". Slam Wrestling.
• From Christopher Daniels: "Christopher Daniels Slam! Sports Bio". SLAM! Sports. Retrieved 2008-07-02.
• From Taylor Wilde: LaCroix, Corey David (2006-02-08). "Shantelle Taylor mixes learning with wrestling". Slam! Sports. Canadian Online Explorer. Retrieved 2008-09-12.
• From Sting (wrestler): "Sting's bio". SLAM sports. Retrieved 2008-08-19.
• From Kazarian (wrestler): Milner, John M. "Frankie Kazarian". SLAM! Sports. Retrieved 2009-01-24.
• From Chris Sabin: Milner, John M. "Chris Sabin". SLAM! Sports. Retrieved 2009-01-26.

I apologize if any of the above are effectively identical; I am just a simple computer program, so I can't determine whether minor differences are significant or not. AnomieBOT⚡ 14:46, 28 January 2014 (UTC)

Sanada

As long as Sanada has the X Title, he should be included on the roster.

Champions automatically go on the roster anyway (as was agreed to way back when when the current table listing format was introduced), and I made sure to add a note that Sanada's with TNA as part of the TNA/Wrestle-1 talent exchange partnership, and not as a TNA contracted wrestler himself.

Vjmlhds (talk) 19:14, 2 March 2014 (UTC)

Mahabali Shera

I suck at editing, but the real name of the new Indian wrestler introduced by Kurt Angle as Mahabali Shera is Amanpreet Singh, not Mahabali Veera (which was his ring name in Ring Ka King). — Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.229.171.156 (talk) 23:25, 24 September 2014 (UTC)

Rampage and others

Rampage is still on the tna roster page and yet he was removed from here. Any reason why? Do we have any sources maybe they were already shown, for Rampage, Brittani, Gail Kim, and Team 3D leaving? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 72.15.25.104 (talk) 20:15, 6 December 2014 (UTC)

Rampage's TNA and Bellator deals were part of the same Viacom deal, which he recently tore up to rejoin UFC. Even if he hadn't, TNA's move from Spike would have put an end to that section. And even before that, he said they lied to him and "...you won’t see me in TNA ever again."

Not as sure about the others. InedibleHulk (talk) 23:03, 11 January 2015 (UTC)

Here's one saying Team 3D are done. InedibleHulk (talk) 23:04, 11 January 2015 (UTC)

I looked at the TNA website a couple days ago and it has all except Gail gone and I believe Gail is still on this page so we are all good now. So its official that all except Gail are gone, well according to TNA website. 72.15.25.104 (talk) 14:52, 12 January 2015 (UTC)

As for Lashley, I recently removed the Bellator/TNA joint contract note, assuming it couldn't work with the channel switch. In case my assumption isn't good enough for anyone, here is Lashley talking about his new (possibly still unsigned) Bellator contract. InedibleHulk (talk) 23:45, 18 February 2015 (UTC)

Gregory Shane Helms

Gregory Shane Helms, why isn't he in the TNA Other on-air personnel section when all other TNA managers are listed there? So far he has yet to wrestle in TNA whereas Tyrus is both wrestling in TNA and co-managing Matt Hardy with Reby Sky with Tyrus being Matt Hardy's bodyguard. 90.202.105.108 (talk) 12:22, 18 February 2016 (UTC)

He's pretty much a player-coach, so he belongs on the main roster - besides, there's no reason to have him in his own section. Vjmlhds (talk) 20:17, 18 February 2016 (UTC)

Protected edit request on 26 February 2016

I want to revert the vandalism an IP user has put on here before the page got protected. Keith Okamoto (talk) 20:19, 26 February 2016 (UTC)

Not done: it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a "change X to Y" format. Mlpearc (open channel) 20:25, 26 February 2016 (UTC)

Keith Okamoto's talking about deliberate misspellings at the top of the article, done specifically as vandalism. Vjmlhds (talk) 20:49, 26 February 2016 (UTC)

OK, I had no way of knowing. I've re-activated the request. Mlpearc (open channel) 20:52, 26 February 2016 (UTC)

Done — Martin (MSGJ · talk) 22:20, 26 February 2016 (UTC)

Knockouts

Please leave all the ladies listed in the Knockout section as is.

All these girls are wrestlers by trade, with the records to prove it.

When the Knockouts only get 1 match per week, there's no way they can all wrestle each and every week.

But they are all legitimate, honest-to-God, documented wrestlers (unlike Lana in WWE, who never wrestled a match in her life and is strictly a manager).

So there's no need to list them as "other personnel", because as a rule, women wrestlers should be cut some slack simply because they don't wrestle as often as the guys, and because they are all actual wrestlers with the records to show it.

Thank you.

Vjmlhds (talk) 15:24, 21 February 2016 (UTC)

Anybody else want to chime in here? Should Maria, Reby Sky, Rosemary, and Raquel be listed as wrestlers or other personnel? Remember this though...Maria was a participant in the Lethal Lockdown match on Tuesday and is starting a feud with Gail Kim (not to mention having wrestled numerous times in both WWE and ROH). Rosemary and Raquel - while not yet having their first TNA match - wrestled in the indies prior to coming to TNA, and continue to do so on the side. And Reby Sky is by trade a wrestler, and is making noise about going for the KO Title. They are not like Lana in WWE...she has never wrestled a match in her life and is STRICTLY a manager. All these TNA girls are more than merely "other personnel" - they're honest to God wrestlers. Vjmlhds (talk) 02:26, 26 February 2016 (UTC)

.com/people/gabi-castrovinci.html A little info on Raquel...described as a wrestler/fitness model And here's an article where Raquel talks about getting stiffed while WRESTLING during an indy show over the weekend...BTW she trained with Afa. Vjmlhds (talk) 02:44, 26 February 2016 (UTC)

Here's an interview with Abyss, where he talks about what a force Rosemary is gonna be in the Knockouts division, indicating that she's a looked at as a wrestler by the company. Vjmlhds (talk) 02:53, 26 February 2016 (UTC)

All of these references say nothing about how they are currently competing under the promotion, which they are not. Regardless of what their wrestling background is, they should not be listed as wrestlers in the personnel page until they wrestle their first match. Doing otherwise would be speculating. It could be weeks to months until Reby Sky actually wrestles a match, which is a speculation. It could also be in the very near future that she wrestles, which is another speculation. As of this time, none of the aforementioned Knockouts have wrestled under TNA, making them managers. DantODB (talk) 03:02, 26 February 2016 (UTC)

"...because as a rule, women wrestlers should be cut some slack simply because they don't wrestle as often as the guys, and because they are all actual wrestlers with the records to show it." This sounds like an opinion. The fact is that they have not wrestled under the promotion. Regardless of what the reasoning is, they haven't competed, hence, they are not competitors. This will surely change in the future, but the personnel page should reflect on the present. DantODB (talk) 03:04, 26 February 2016 (UTC)

Let a third voice chime in and settle it, and see how it goes...until then leave it as is. Vjmlhds (talk) 03:09, 26 February 2016 (UTC)

Regarding my "opinions" - there is no "bible" for how to do articles like these..they've always kind of been "play it by ear". Therefore a statement like the one I made provides reasoning for why I have the view I have...it isn't just because "I said so"...there's method to the madness. What you're doing is going on a 1-man crusade to force your version down people's throats...that's not how this works. Let others speak their piece and go from there. Vjmlhds (talk) 03:16, 26 February 2016 (UTC)

I don't have opinions regarding who should be put where. I'm only standing by facts. DantODB (talk) 03:26, 26 February 2016 (UTC)

You're not stating facts...you're just trying to act like a big shot. Just because YOU say it's a fact, doesn't mean it is. Vjmlhds (talk) 05:02, 26 February 2016 (UTC)

How is it not a fact that the aforementioned Knockouts have not competed in TNA when they haven't? I'm just trying to maintain the integrity and accuracy of this page. DantODB (talk) 08:17, 26 February 2016 (UTC)

WP:BRD ---> You made a bold edit, I reverted due to it's controversial nature, and now this is where we discuss it. Obviously we are at a stalemate, which is why I've asked for other editors to give their 2 cents. UNTIL THE ISSUE IS RESOLVED, DO NOT CHANGE THE ARTICLE BACK TO YOUR VERSION. It is NOT your place to be judge, jury, and executioner. All you are doing is playing tit for tat, which will get you blocked. I reverted your original change because all the women are wrestlers by trade, and just because they aren't wrestling RIGHT NOW THIS SECOND, it doesn't mean they are strictly other personnel. So enough of the foolishness. Wait until other voices can be heard brfore proceeding...you are in no position to play "my way or the highway". User:Vjmlhds (talk) 15:45, 26 February 2016 (UTC)

How is it a bold edit when I moved the new Knockouts to a new section not long after they are added to the roster? I didn't move Madison Rayne or Marti Bell or any of the existing Knockouts, which means that it's not bold. You keep referring to Wikipedia pages that actually bears little relevance to the situation. Also, you keep threatening a block and I don't think you're in the position or power to do that, so I don't understand what the point of that is. DantODB (talk) 16:27, 26 February 2016 (UTC)

I have full-protected the article for 24 hours to stop the edit-warring between you. You both need to calm down, take a deep breath, and edit another article for a bit. Ritchie333 ^{(talk) (cont)} 18:18, 26 February 2016 (UTC)

Breath taken...the issue at hand is that all these ladies are wrestlers, and should be listed as such...they've all wrestled everywhere they have been, and really JUST GOT TO TNA. Maria's already had a TNA match, (Lethal Lockdown...she was an official participant...no law that says you must have physical contact). To pigeonhole them strictly as "other personnel" is just nonsense given their track record. The "Nothing else matters except RIGHT NOW THIS SECOND" theory is extremely myopic. That's like saying a football team signed a quarterback, but because HE'S YET TO PLAY A GAME WITH THE TEAM THAT SIGNED HIM, he's not a quarterback RIGHT NOW THIS SECOND. Add that in with the fact that DantODB is completely disregarding WP:BRD, and is showing WP:OWN tendencies. Both his theory is wrong, and the way he's trying to ramrod his view is wrong, which is why I asked for a block regarding his behavior. Vjmlhds (talk) 20:09, 26 February 2016 (UTC)

Even Vjmlhds understands that the Knockouts in question have NOT wrestled under TNA. How is it correct to put them under the female wrestlers section if their current roles in the company are not that? We need to reflect on present times. In the future, I am sure they will wrestle matches, but as of right now, they have not, so they remain managers. Regardless of what their wrestling background is, this personnel page should put Raquel, Reby Sky and Rosemary in a separate section until they compete in TNA. "...showing WP:OWN tendencies. Both his theory is wrong, and the way he's trying to ramrod his view is wrong..." - how is putting female wrestlers that have yet competed in the company an accurate representation of their roles as part of the TNA personnel? DantODB (talk) 20:16, 26 February 2016 (UTC)

So if they wrestle, and then don't for 3 weeks, you gonna move them back to "other personnel"? This is what I mean...the RIGHT NOW THIS SECOND theory...and YOU yourself just called them female wrestlers and acknowledged their backgrounds. They are wrestlers...there's only so many hours in a day, and so many matches on a card. Seriously...don't be so darn strident. Vjmlhds (talk) 20:56, 26 February 2016 (UTC)

Whether they wrestle or not in the future is a speculation. Yes, they are wrestlers. I have not once said that they were not. I have also abundantly mentioned that being in the other on-air personnel section does not take away their wrestling background. Whatever the reasoning is, if they have not wrestled a match under the promotion, THEY SHOULD NOT BE CONSIDERED COMPETITORS IN THE PROMOTION. This just pertains to TNA. In the Indies, THEY ARE ALL ACTIVE COMPETITORS. It's not about who is a wrestler and who is not. It's about what roles they play. If they wrestle once and then don't wrestle for three weeks, then they would still play A COMPETITOR IN THE COMPANY THAT IS SIDELINED. As of now, this is not the case. The fact is they HAVE NOT WRESTLED YET. Strident or not, that's the fact. DantODB (talk) 21:02, 26 February 2016 (UTC)

Football team signs a player, player doesn't play in a game yet - THEY SHOULD NOT BE CONSIDERED A PLAYER ON THE TEAM. If I took that argument to a football article, they'd laugh me out of town, and tell me to take a hike. That is EXACTLY what you're bringing to this party with your theory. You make no sense. Vjmlhds (talk) 21:26, 26 February 2016 (UTC)

Common sense says you should perhaps get opinions from outside editors. Perhaps one of you should initiate that instead of yelling at each other and edit warring... --Tarage (talk) 21:48, 26 February 2016 (UTC)

I'm trying - I've asked/suggested having a third voice come in and settle this (look above) - none has so far. Vjmlhds (talk) 22:48, 26 February 2016 (UTC)

Try harder: WP:3 --Tarage (talk) 01:03, 27 February 2016 (UTC)

Third Opinion

A third opinion has been requested. The question appears to have to do with whether particular women should be listed as wrestlers. Is that the question? My answer would be to list them if they are under contract to TNA and have ever wrestled professionally, whether for TNA or any other company. If that is the question, that is the third opinion. If not, please state the question. Robert McClenon (talk) 02:24, 27 February 2016 (UTC)

That is exactly what the question was. They are obviously under contract (otherwise they wouldn't be on TNA programming), and they all have (and in some cases still do on the side) wrestle for other companies. Thank you for your assistance. Vjmlhds (talk) 03:15, 27 February 2016 (UTC)

Actually, for the sake of clarity, the question was whether female wrestlers that as of now have not wrestled under the company and are playing managerial roles should be listed under the female wrestlers category or the other on-air personnel category. This is due to the fact that we don't know what roles they are contracted to perform. As of this time, they have not competed in TNA. I, too, thank you for the assistance. DantODB (talk) 03:27, 27 February 2016 (UTC)

Also, to counter one of your arguments, Raquel was not a wrestler before entering Tough Enough. That was her first wrestling experience. The only other match that we've heard her been in was the one reported on TMZ. To see how long it takes for her compete in TNA is speculating. I still find this irrelevant to the predicament, though. The situation at hand is basically equivalent to listing Lita as a Diva in the WWE personnel page since she is a wrestler. DantODB (talk) 03:36, 27 February 2016 (UTC)

Lita had neck surgery (another one), CAN'T wrestle anymore, and has retired...invalid argument. About Raquel...everybody's gotta start somewhere, and the point is that she IS a documented wrestler. Look - the third voice has chimed in and agreed with me, that they should be listed as wrestlers. You made a bold edit, I reverted, it led to a discussion, and a tie breaking vote was cast, that just happened to be in my favor. The process works. You didn't get your way...take it like a man, and move on. There have been other articles where I was on the losing end of the stick in similar situations - I took my medicine, and life went on. I strongly suggest you do the same, because if you revert again EVEN AFTER a third, unbiased voice chimed in and voted against you, it will not look good for you...I saw that you have been warned about being thisclose to a block (and not by me), so please don't press your luck. Vjmlhds (talk) 04:58, 27 February 2016 (UTC)

BTW...Reby Sky HAS wrestled a pair of matches in TNA as part of their Knockouts Knockdown 2 PPV in 2014...soon after that, she got pregnant and had her kid, which put her career on hold, and has obviously returned. So your "never wrestled in TNA" theory is out the window. Think before you speak and cause a ruckus. Vjmlhds (talk) 06:04, 27 February 2016 (UTC)

I rephrased the question for the sake of clarity and that has not been answered. How is the theory out of the window when Raquel and Rosemary have not wrestled a match in TNA? Why are all of your points directed towards me as an editor and not towards getting the correct information for the page? You got the same, exact warning of blockage that I did, so why is it necessary to bring this up to intimidate me? I'm just trying to make this page an accurate representation of the TNA personnel of the present. Please disregard any and all feelings towards me and focus on the article. DantODB (talk) 21:19, 27 February 2016 (UTC)

Grasping at straws, bud. You've been warned - don't poke the bear. Vjmlhds (talk) 21:36, 27 February 2016 (UTC)

How is this about you? As I said, make it more about the article and less about how you perceive me as an editor. WP:NPA - you might want to take a look at this. DantODB (talk) 01:56, 28 February 2016 (UTC)

It's not about me at all - when I said don't poke the bear, that was meant to be friendly advice about not tempting fate with the article seeing as the third voice chimed in and agreed with my view, and also keeping in mind your block warning (if you took it differently, I'm sorry...should have been clearer in my intent). This was never personal, we had differing views about the article, we had an (admittedly) rough and tough disagreement, and after some time to cool our jets, I sought out an outside voice, one came along and settled the issue. It's done. Vjmlhds (talk) 03:37, 28 February 2016 (UTC)