Talk:Santa Claus

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Did you know nomination

The following is an archived discussion of the DYK nomination of the article below. Please do not modify this page. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as this nomination's talk page, the article's talk page or Wikipedia talk:Did you know), unless there is consensus to re-open the discussion at this page. No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was: rejected by 97198 (talk) 10:38, 7 July 2022 (UTC)[reply]

( Comment or view )

( Article history links:

)

... that fans of the Philadelphia Eagles threw snowballs at Santa Claus? Source: https://www.thedp.com/article/2020/12/penn-football-franklin-field-eagles-santa
- ALT1: ... that during the Philadelphia Eagles Santa Claus incident, Eagles fans booed Santa Claus? Source: https://www.thedp.com/article/2020/12/penn-football-franklin-field-eagles-santa
- Reviewed:

Created by Sportsfangnome (talk). Self-nominated at 13:03, 6 July 2022 (UTC).[reply]

Sorry, Sportsfangnome, but just as in your last nomination, none of the articles is eligible because none of them has been recently created or expanded 5x or promoted to Good Article. Please, please, please read WP:DYK, especially the section on eligibility criteria, before submitting any more nominations. MANdARAX XAЯAbИAM 14:11, 6 July 2022 (UTC)[reply]

New-Amsterdam?

The article mentions that the current image of Santa Claus is based on these 19th century Dutch immigrants coming to New Amsterdam. Besides the lack of any citation, New Amsterdam became New York after the second Anglo-Dutch war, in which the Dutch traded their colony for Surinam. After that, the colony became known as New York. So, why is this mentioned? Quirinius Germanicus (talk) 20:51, 4 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Encyclopedia Brittanica:

https://www.britannica.com/topic/Santa-Claus

The Dutch are credited with transporting the legend of Saint Nicholas (Sinterklaas) to New Amsterdam (now New York City) Helioz9 (talk) 22:35, 24 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Wikipedia is not censored for this article?

I don't get it, in one of the templates for the talk page it says "Wikipedia is not censored" What is not censored for this article? 73.216.182.68 (talk) 13:41, 5 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

It means what it says: Wikipedia is not censored. It's not just on this article, too, it's all across the entire wiki. SleepDeprivedGinger (talk) 18:27, 5 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Usually, censorship inquiries are about Not safe for work ("NSFW") content. Someone might ask, for example, why there is a photo of two real naked adults at Human body, instead of just drawings.

In this case, the application "not censored" means: This article will not tell your kids that Santa is real, or even make it sound like Santa might be real. Parents who wish otherwise might want to read Santa Claus#Representation to children. The second paragraph has statistics on age-appropriate beliefs. WhatamIdoing (talk) 03:37, 6 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Then again, maybe this Puck cover used on the page puts the "naughty" in "naughty or nice". Randy Kryn (talk) 03:41, 6 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I Saw Mommy Kissing Santa Claus... WhatamIdoing (talk) 01:49, 7 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Santa is not Odin

This is a pop culture idea that has become very popular in neopagan circles despite the history and evolution of Saint Nicholas to Santa Claus being well attested. The source used in the article currently is Margaret Baker, an author who wrote some books on magical gardening and such with no academic credentials I can find, which I don't believe to be appropriate. Here's articles by actual academics on the subject all stating that this idea is modern and inaccurate.

No, Santa Claus Is Not Inspired by Odin

Odin Isn't Santa Claus - Youtube video by Dr. Jackson Crawford

Concerning Yule Fwinzor (talk) 16:35, 9 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I spent a couple of minutes looking for a source, and found this:

"Meanwhile in England, where he was known as Old Father Christmas – no doubt inspired by the Scandinavian god Odin – Santa Claus was often dressed in green, and wore a holly crown over his head. That pagan figure appeared in numerous Victorian images."

in Prah-Perrochon, Anne. 2015. “The Invention of Santa Claus.” France-Amérique 8 (12): 32–41.

That adds a layer of complexity. St Nicholas doesn't descend from Odin, but Old Father Christmas might, and if Old Father Christmas was grafted on top of St Nicholas to produce "Santa", then there would be some connection there. I think this is going to require more time looking for scholarly sources. WhatamIdoing (talk) 05:55, 11 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

The words "no doubt" are doing a lot of heavy lifting there. There is to my knowledge no historical evidence of that whatsoever, in spite of popular belief to the contrary. Old Father Christmas was not a "pagan figure" – he was, as the name suggests, a personification of Christmas. Read the first two or three sections of Father Christmas (I wrote them, relying on proper scholarly sources such as Ronald Hutton). MichaelMaggs (talk) 09:48, 11 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

May also be of interest: an editor wishes to add to Santa Claus's reindeer an assertion that "The original mythical gift-giver portrayed as riding a reindeer-pulled sleigh was probably the Finnish god Ukko." See Talk:Santa_Claus's_reindeer#Finnish_idea_of_reindeer_(not_Odin). MichaelMaggs (talk) 11:12, 11 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

@MichaelMaggs, having thought about this for a very small number of minutes, I've come to a conclusion: If you think anything in this article is wrong, I'd be happy to have you remove it (or tag it, if you think it's redeemable). WhatamIdoing (talk) 05:58, 28 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I've been thinking about tackling this article for several years, but have always been discouraged by the time it would take. There's just so much to do. MichaelMaggs (talk) 15:50, 29 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

True, but perhaps just fixing up the Santa Claus#Predecessor figures or Santa Claus#History sections would feel more manageable? WhatamIdoing (talk) 20:10, 29 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Christmas Eve Gift for Santa

In New Zealand today we do not leave sherry/beer/mince pies. We are firmly in the milk and cookies camp. No current references in the article point to why it is believed that New Zealand leave sherry/beer/mince pies - this would possible be a historical thing when we were more closely aligned with Britain. 203.109.193.87 (talk) 10:28, 24 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Thank your for the note. The entire paragraph is unsourced. I can attest that milk and cookies are a think in the US/in my news feed, but I've no idea about British or Aussie traditions. Let's see: @Casliber or @SHB2000, do you happen to know the Australian tradition? Does Santa really get mince pies and alcoholic drinks in Australia? WhatamIdoing (talk) 06:01, 28 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Back as a kid I used to just put milk and cookies too – no idea if it's changed or if it differs by region, not too sure. --SHB2000 (talk) 06:11, 28 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Milk and cookies seem to be the universal Santa treat. Claus driving drunk in New Zealand may be OR. Randy Kryn (talk) 12:40, 28 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Or maybe it was a thing 50–100 years ago, but isn't any longer?

I'm going to remove the uncited claim, though https://trialsjournal.biomedcentral.com/articles/10.1186/s13063-024-08604-w suggests that leaving out a bit of sherry isn't unknown. WhatamIdoing (talk) 01:52, 29 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

errr.....carrots? Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 02:52, 29 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I have heard of people leaving carrots out (for the reindeer). WhatamIdoing (talk) 07:23, 29 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Change the infobox

Santa isn't a legendary person, it's only a mythological person just like all the other characters listed i nthis article that are similar to hin Viceskeeni2 (talk) 00:38, 26 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Please gain consensus to make that change. The article lead lists him as a legendary person. Also, please review the talk archives for every previous discussion.--☾Loriendrew☽ ☏(ring-ring) 00:57, 26 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Because Santa is partly based on the real-world figure of Saint Nicholas, that makes him a Legend. That is, no matter how much fiction has been larded on top, if you scrape off all the fiction, there is some tiny speck of actual human history inside it. This contrasts with a mythological person, such as a gnome, or a folkloric person, such as the Tooth Fairy, which don't even have a tiny speck of a real human underneath the stories. WhatamIdoing (talk) 06:09, 28 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]